The Bob Show

General discussion about the sport of hang gliding
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: The Bob Show

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=877
Discuss Tad here
Bob Kuczewski - 2017/08/10 18:48:38 UTC

I am writing to again document that posts are being changed and moved on the kitestrings.org web site. The most recent round of mutilation happened within the week prior to this post.

I want to again state that such alterations are destructive to the history of hang gliding and the history of humanity in general.
I am writing to again document that posts are being changed and moved on the kitestrings.org web site.
- Forum.

- Posts are ALWAYS being changed and/or moved on the Kite Strings forum. If you wanna save some bandwidth document the periods when they're NOT.

- A bit odd, dontchya think, that with the massive hostility in the hang gliding cybersphere to T** at K*** S****** and his Hole In The Ground that you're the only one making this particular point? Also that none of your loyal subjects over there has ever expressed anything in the way of giving a flying fuck?
The most recent round of mutilation happened within the week prior to this post.
Funny you're not documenting any of these mutilations. It would be so easy to do and people would be able to see how absolutely outrageous they are and could become appropriately absolutely outraged.
I want to again state that such alterations are destructive to the history of hang gliding...
How 'bout THIS alteration, Bob?:
Manned Kiting
The Basic Handbook of Tow Launched Hang Gliding
Daniel F. Poynter
1974

"The greatest dangers are a rope break or a premature release." - Richard Johnson
Donnell Hewett - 1980/12

WEAK LINK

Skyting requires the use of an infallible weak link to place an absolute upper limit to the towline tension in the unlikely event that everything else fails.

Now I've heard the argument that "Weak links always break at the worst possible time, when the glider is climbing hard in a near stall situation," and that "More people have been injured because of a weak link than saved by one." Well, I for one have been saved by a weak link and would not even consider towing without one. I want to know without a doubt (1) when I am pushing too hard, and (2) what will break when I push too hard, and (3) that no other damage need result because I push too hard.

Furthermore, I will not use a mechanical weak link no matter how elaborate or expensive because there is always the possibility that it may fail to operate properly. In skyting we use a simple and inexpensive strand of nylon fishing line which breaks at the desired tension limit. There is no possible way for it to jam and fail to release when the maximum tension is exceeded. Sure, it may get weaker through aging or wear and break too soon, but it cannot get stronger and fail to break. If it does break too soon, so what? We simply replace it with a fresh one.

A properly designed weak link must be strong enough to permit a good rate of climb without breaking, and it must be weak enough to break before the glider gets out of control, stalls, or collapses.
All the aeronautical theory and common sense of near eight decades of conventional aviation and everything prior in hang gliding gets stood on its head by a single lunatic who puts hang gliding on a back burner behind Jesus, HIS family, and HIS profession in that order.

Little thought here...
Donnell Hewett - 1981/10

MY PRIORITIES

My third priority belongs to my profession, I am a professor at Texas A&I University and teach physics, astronomy, and solar energy. I am also conducting research in the field of solar energy in an attempt to develop some truly cost effective solar energy devices (including a solar air conditioner). Since these activities are my primary means of support, are obligations I have voluntarily accepted, and are both enjoyable and fullfilling to me as a person, I consider both my teaching and my solar energy research to be more important than my involvement in hang gliding.
If you suck so much at the aerodynamics of hang glider control that you get elements literally totally backwards you also really suck at your profession. And if you really suck at your profession your not doing what you should be for your family. And Jesus obviously doesn't give a rat's ass one way or the other about anything that goes on with this sport, Donnell's theory, the endless hundreds of victims.
...and the history of humanity in general.
Oh the humanity in general.
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Tad Eareckson
Posts: 9150
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Re: The Bob Show

Post by Tad Eareckson »

Furthermore Bob...
Bob Kuczewski - 2017/08/05 18:51:10 UTC

When I saw your earlier on-topic post (thanks again), I decided there was no benefit to being further critical of all the off-topic posts. So I pulled my post a few seconds after posting it.
No you didn't. I just went into the ACP looking for a "deleted posts buffer" and discovered some bells and whistles I didn't know about before.

Moderator log
bobk - 2017/08/05 16:03:19 UTC - Deleted post "Re: Breaking USHPA's Monopoly Control of Flying Sites" written by > bobk
And the post was time stamped 2017/08/05 16:01:34 UTC. So now we know that a few Bob seconds are 105 / 1.75 minutes. Which jibes with reality a lot better. 'Cause you've gotta see that there was a subsequent post, read enough of it to get its gist, make a decision to delete your post, execute - all with the limitations of an iPhone.

Then you accuse me of...
Since you've dredged it up from the deleted posts buffer...
...dredging it up from the deleted posts buffer - which I still don't believe exists for this forum - and don't retract or apologize when I state otherwise.

Sorry, 1.75 minutes is not by any definition "a few seconds". Anybody who thinks otherwise should try holding his breath for a few seconds.

You delete without a public trace an entire 165 word post from the record of Kite Strings and that's OK 'cause Bob has reasons and tie us up for gawd knows how many hours over changing an "i" to a "y" in Jonathan's last name to protect his privacy a wee bit.

I see that as stunningly hypocritical - consistent with tons of other stuff you do all the freakin' time - and a stellar example of why you don't merit being a member and why we can't afford to have you participating here directly.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: The Bob Show

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.shga.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=5182
Calling USHPA's Bluff
NMERider - 2017/09/20 04:26:22 UTC

Even Tad Earekson...
Eareckson.
...reinstated BK to Kitestrings.org...
Not really. I banned Bob 2012/05/07 12:38:07 UTC for going about ten miles beyond the pale and hovering there for weeks. And I'm gonna say "Bob WAS banned..." 'cause it was for repeated blatant violations of the clearly stated and perfectly reasonable forum rules, after a blindingly clear warning, and over the objections of no one other than Bob anywhere. He's never been officially reinstated and pretty much certainly never will be under my watch but on several occasions I've reconnected his wire as a courtesy to allow him full member access on the condition that he doesn't post to the forum.

And on every occasion he's violated the condition and posted to the forum. And on every occasion I've cut him slack, hoping for something on the order of a positive, productive dialogue. Run the same experiment, hoped for different results. And guess what.
...but Bob's pathological 'Bobism' made that indulgence rather short-lived.
Couldn't have said it any better with a gun to my head.
Bob Kuczewski - 2017/09/20 10:54:51 UTC

Another misleading statement by NME. Tad actually kicked me off...
It was actually Steve who kicked you off. Kite Strings is a solid enough hang gliding presence to be able to chug along just fine with 19 members with Moderator access and privileges. That's over 86 percent of the number of individuals who've made one or more posts. And that's precisely 100 percent of the number of individuals who've made one or more posts and haven't been banned. (Although not all who've posted and haven't been banned have Moderator privileges. There are four members who've never posted who are designated Moderators.)

But no big deal. Steve just beat me to it, saved me the trouble.
...for using the name "Jonathan Dyetch" in my posts after he'd told me not to do so.
And the usual host of other issues I don't even feel like dredging up again. But everything's public and anybody with the necessary reserves of time and aspirin is perfectly free to wade through the posts.
Tad goes to great lengths to expose the real names of people on his forum.
1. Tad doesn't deserve all the credit for the outings. The Team has done a lot of excellent background work.

2. Anybody - other than the targets - got any objections to any of the outings? Any good people with legitimate reasons for concealing identity (e.g., whistleblowers fearing retaliation) been hurt?
It makes me wonder what kind of unholy bargain was made for Tad to ban people for using the name "Jonathan Dyetch"?
I'm sure it does, Bob. No fuckin' way could it be anything as simple and innocuous as a courtesy extended to Jonathan in response to his request having to do with a privacy issue having absolutely nothing to do with hang gliding culture - in which his full identity has been well known to everyone and his dog for the past decade.
Maybe Jonathan threatened him as he did with the SHGA?
Threatened him with WHAT? Getting his flying site access restricted? Getting him banned from the top five hang gliding discussion groups? Outing him as an unrepentant child molester? Killing his bird? Forcing him to hook behind a Dragonfly with a driver who can fix whatever's going on back there by giving him the rope and a pro toad bridle, bent pin release, and standard aerotow weak link? Putting him on a launch ramp and forcing him to raise his wing into the turbulent jet stream?
But that discussion would deserve it's...
Its.
...own topic.
Fine. But if you start one you won't be starting it here. But rest assured it will be accurately quoted and responded to.

This is exactly why you're banned here and I'd never waste the time to post a punctuation mark in the dump you control with a gun to my head. Bob's pathological Bobism. Even when you're mostly or totally on the right side of something the prospect of the inevitable migraines makes one think ten or fifteen times.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: The Bob Show

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.shga.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=5789
Where to have changed course?
NMERider - 2017/10/02 19:19:03 UTC

No Bob. I've given it plenty of thought and you handled it wrong. When has any of your meddling ever prevented an otherwise avoidable accident? The way I see it is you may have created a backlash and actually worsened the situation. I looked at all the documentation that was shared with USHPA members when you were expelled. The other expert witnesses were on the side of USHPA and had stellar credentials. The only good, if any, that your presence did was to create what is know as nuisance value to the plaintiffs. Had the case gone to trial Shanon would have ended up in debt. Any award that a jury may have approved would have been less than her legal fees. Any award that the insurance company gave Shanon was less than or equal to the cost of defending the case regardless of the outcome. That's why it's called nuisance value or a nuisance settlement. Sadly, you made such a nuisance of yourself that you were given the boot. Too bad about that. I never had any issues with your own flying.
I've given it plenty of thought and you handled it wrong.
So what would've been the right way to have handled it?
When has any of your meddling ever prevented an otherwise avoidable accident?
When did any of Doug Hildreth's meddling...
Doug Hildreth - 1991/06

Pilot with some tow experience was towing on a new glider which was a little small for him. Good launch, but at about fifty feet the glider nosed up, stalled, and the pilot released by letting go of the basetube with right hand. Glider did a wingover to the left and crashed into a field next to the tow road. Amazingly, there were minimal injuries.

Comment: This scenario has been reported numerous times. Obviously, the primary problem is the lack of pilot skill and experience in avoiding low-level, post-launch, nose-high stalls. The emphasis by countless reporters that the pilot lets go of the glider with his right hand to activate the release seems to indicate that we need a better hands-on way to release.

I know, I know, "If they would just do it right. Our current system is really okay." I'm just telling you what's going on in the real world. They are not doing it right and it's up to us to fix the problem. Think about it.
...ever prevent an otherwise avoidable "accident"?
I looked at all the documentation that was shared with USHPA members when you were expelled.
Yes Jonathan. All the documentation that was shared with USHPA members when he was expelled. Sorry, I tend to be just interested in all the documentation that ISN'T being SHARED and wonder why one needs to be a u$hPa member to have free access.
The other expert witnesses were on the side of USHPA and had stellar credentials.
Wow. Really makes one wonder why the decision went the other way, don't it?
The only good, if any, that your presence did was to create what is know as nuisance value to the plaintiffs. Had the case gone to trial Shanon would have ended up in debt. Any award that a jury may have approved would have been less than her legal fees. Any award that the insurance company gave Shanon was less than or equal to the cost of defending the case regardless of the outcome. That's why it's called nuisance value or a nuisance settlement.
We know all this for sure?
Sadly, you made such a nuisance of yourself that you were given the boot.
And it's right there in the u$hPa Bylaws that making a nuisance of oneself is solid grounds for being given the boot. And that the boot hearing will be closed to the public and no recording will be permitted.
Too bad about that. I never had any issues with your own flying.
Does it comply with:
With each flight, demonstrates a method of establishing that the pilot is hooked in just prior to launch.
as defined in the 1981/05 George Whitehill magazine article which introduced the new Pilot Proficiency System SOP?

That whole u$hPa / Air California Adventure / San Diego City Council situation shit heap stinks beyond all imagination. Bob's gonna throw at it any and every thing he thinks has a snowball's chance in hell of sticking. Lots of it is gonna be total rot - and he will happily and deliberately take things out of context and misrepresent what's going on to try to get it to stick. But a substantial percentage of it is gonna be massively legit (inevitably) - and it's a pity he doesn't confine himself to attacks based on the latter.

u$hPa and ACA had all the legal firepower and expert witnesses with stellar credentials - not to mention righteousness on their side. So how come the court came out on the other side? Were they clearly in the right yet just incompetent on the legal battlefield? If so:

- How come they haven't made that claim and educated the membership and public about what they did wrong?

- Are there any other areas - like hang and para gliding for instance - in which they might also be deficient in the competency department?

Based upon an open statement like:

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25321
Stop the Stupids at the USHPA BOD meeting
Mark G. Forbes - 2011/09/29 02:26:23 UTC

We can establish rules which we think will improve pilot safety, but our attorney is right. USHPA is not in the business of keeping pilots "safe" and it can't be. Stepping into that morass is a recipe for extinction of our association.
I'd say pretty fucking obviously YES. Or can you point to some aspects of the sport not grounded in the fundamentals of safe control of one's aircraft at all times?

Now that I think about it and with Nate Hallahan's videos fresh in my mind isn't 99 percent of new pilot training dedicated to nothing but being able to perfectly safely spot land in narrow dry riverbeds with large rocks strewn all over the place? Including the ones we occasionally find at two thousand feet AGL?

Here's Shannon right after the midair:

008-022312
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009-022329
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and about a millisecond away from getting permanently physically destroyed:

010-022404
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7667/17204865461_331a225ef4_o.png
Image

---
Brad:
Um... I think it was pretty severe. Judging by the way she hit the ground I'm gonna guess she probably has a collarbone, shoulder, arm, rib injury... Something like that. Probable lung injury...
-
Zack:
Lung injury?
-
Brad:
Lungs? She hit on her side pretty hard. It would be like falling off of a rooftop and landing on your side. So like probably... She probably had...
-
047-110222
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7664/17203775132_7178d0f39f_o.png
Image
-
...a lot of damage in that area. I don't know. We're not gonna know until a little later here.
---

(It's a little later and we know now.)

Brad gets his tandem instructor ticket permanently revoked for:

111-220305
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113-220710
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8700/17205433495_ea31ccab99_o.png
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217-315023
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224-321609
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8818/17019253769_073746de33_o.png
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Zero violations of FAA regs or infringement on u$hPa SOPs. Kids, Mom, tandem drivers all happy as clams at high water.

But the Torrey instructor on the other end of the radio who got his student:

013-022502
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015-023105
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did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WRONG. Not so much as a remedial risk management seminar - within the next sixty days so it won't cut into your radio controlled teaching schedule.

And nobody seems to have the slightest problem with any of this. Not a peep ANYWHERE from anybody standing up for Brad. Or support for a system of due process.
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NMERider
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Re: The Bob Show

Post by NMERider »

Tad Eareckson wrote: http://www.shga.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=5789
....
When has any of your meddling ever prevented an otherwise avoidable accident?
When did any of Doug Hildreth's meddling...
For the most part, meddling doesn't prevent accidents as much as it contributes to them due to backlash. I've seen it first hand throughout my life.
There are better approaches in life than meddling. Bob meddled when he could have taken a different tack. Think, Dale Carnegie here.
I don't even know who Doug Hildreth is. I was gone between 1982 and 2008. There's a lot of history I have little or no knowledge of.
In Bob's case, sometimes the best outcome comes from walking away and shutting the fuck up.
I looked at all the documentation that was shared with USHPA members when you were expelled.
Yes Jonathan. All the documentation that was shared with USHPA members when he was expelled. Sorry, I tend to be just interested in all the documentation that ISN'T being SHARED and wonder why one needs to be a u$hPa member to have free access.
They didn't sue or prosecute in a court of law. I see no opportunity for discovery of exculpatory material. Bob got kicked out of an organization that sells liability insurance.
If my automobile liability carrier tells me they don't like my driving and gives me the boot there isn't much I can do unless I can prove they broke some law or committed a tort.
USHPA is a liability insurance company and Bob was engaged in activity that undermined the organization.
Bob, himself was given the opportunity to provide his own exculpatory evidence yet failed to respond to the request AFAIK.
I am by no means defending USHPA here. I am saying where Bob went wrong and why he was ineffective in preventing any accidents and why he may have actually hurt Shannon's case.
Yes, she was paid some undisclosed amount of money and I will bet anyone dollars to donuts that Lloyds of London said, "Pay her the nuisance value to make it go away."
It had zilch to do with what a judge or jury might have awarded and everything to do with minimizing legal costs and reduction of attractiveness of the Lloyds investment pool to wealthy Britons.
u$hPa and ACA had all the legal firepower and expert witnesses with stellar credentials - not to mention righteousness on their side. So how come the court came out on the other side? Were they clearly in the right yet just incompetent on the legal battlefield?
The case was settled without a trial. It was settled based upon nuisance value. The settlement documents are non-public. That's the way it works. I've been through this process in a wrongful death case. I got a good settlement on behalf of a family member who died from injuries sustained in an accident. It was a preventable accident by both parties involved. Had it gone to trial the net award would have been zero after legal and expert witness fees were paid. I was the expert witness in the case and presented my evidence to the insurance companies. It was persuasive.

Bob, on the other hand was impeached as a witness. His credibility was a liability. That's all I have to say on the matter.

It's a shame that you and me and the rest of the gang here can't transform the sport into something far safer than it is. It would be great. It's a pipe dream.
At least your effort got me and several other pilots to start doing proper hook-in checks. Our efforts have had an influence on others.
But there comes a point where over-selling safety causes a backlash and the people we see as unsafe tell us all to go fuck ourselves and just engage with even greater carelessness.
This is the dilemma we face and yes, it's frustrating and infuriating.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: The Bob Show

Post by Tad Eareckson »

For the most part, meddling doesn't prevent accidents as much as it contributes to them due to backlash.
I don't know what meddling is in this context. If we see a new Three on a cart about to launch into what he hopes will be thermal conditions on equipment which puts him in clear violation of u$hPa SOPs and FAA aerotow regulations and which we know, if he finds the thermal conditions at the right time, WILL kill him, just as dead and almost as fast as Rafi Lavin's shot sidewire killed him, what are we supposed to do? And should we do anything any differently if the asshole's a professional fully rated u$hPa Tandem Aerotow Instructor?
I've seen it first hand throughout my life.
An example from hang gliding? Or, failing that, not from hang gliding?
There are better approaches in life than meddling.
Meddling sounds a bit like another term for getting involved. And US hang gliding advertises itself as "self-regulating". Anybody have a clue as to what the fuck that's supposed to mean? Obviously nothing to do with electing to fly with an aerotow weak link within the FAA legal range.
Bob meddled when he could have taken a different tack.
Anything that would've changed anything for the better?
Think, Dale Carnegie here.
Yeah. Charles Manson was a big fan. From one of the six major sections:
Twelve Ways to Win People to Your Way of Thinking
As far as Kite Strings is concerned... Shit to do with anyone's way of thinking and everything to do with gravity and its opinion and effect on the human body. I'm not into making friends and influencing people. I'm into providing a forum in which the consequences of the instantaneous subtraction of 200 plus pounds from a towed hang glider will result in a substantial reduction of airspeed and highly likely to produce a severe stall - the consequences of which may be severe up to fatal depending upon altitude and other issues. If that message and the supporting videos and reports resonate people will tend to come on board. And friendships may follow. But they'll be byproducts - not goals - and not byproducts of any way of thinking other than THE way of thinking regarding fundamental aeronautical theory.
I don't even know who Doug Hildreth is.
Robert V. Wills - who had two sons killed in hang gliding (Eric in '74, Bob in '77) did a really good job of crash reporting from the beginning of time through 1981. I think his reporting was more thorough than USHGA wanted - anything he could get his hands on from any source, including a lot of mainstream media - and resulted in him being forced out and never heard from again.

Doug Hildreth was Accident Committee Chairman from 1982 through 1994. Reporting was cut back to US only to make things more palatable but he was pretty thorough, compiled good statistics so we could got a good feel for what was going on, said most of the right things, tireless lift and tug advocate, got totally ignored by all of the Industry and nearly all of the rank and file. Occasional glimmers of conscientiousness after he bailed and then totally down the toilet.
I was gone between 1982 and 2008.
Yeah, that would've done it.
There's a lot of history I have little or no knowledge of.
Just draw a straight line sloping down from 1982 to 2008.
In Bob's case, sometimes the best outcome comes from walking away and shutting the fuck up.
1. Maybe for me too. Let Ryan and Jim do all the talking - seeing as how they both know everything about everything and have since birth.
2. Which is exactly what I'd do if I ever saw either one of those douchebags standing on a ramp with a carabiner dangling. The greater good thing.
They didn't sue or prosecute in a court of law. I see no opportunity for discovery of exculpatory material.
Just listen carefully to the things people are very obviously NOT saying. That usually tells you just about everything you need to know.
Bob got kicked out of an organization that sells liability insurance.
And has decided to get out of the safety business. And to destroy anybody arrogant enough to suggest that fundamental aeronautical principles be applied to hang gliding.
If my automobile liability carrier tells me they don't like my driving and gives me the boot there isn't much I can do unless I can prove they broke some law or committed a tort.
Isn't there some kind of law enforcement entity operating to document the quality of your driving? Also a justice system to review things with input from other perspectives? For white people anyway?
USHPA is a liability insurance company and Bob was engaged in activity that undermined the organization.
What did Kelly...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=32673
This is terrible
Dave Pendzick - 2015/03/30 17:42:41 UTC

This is not going to end well for us...
...Harrison do?
Bob, himself was given the opportunity to provide his own exculpatory evidence yet failed to respond to the request AFAIK.
1. From what was he suppose to have been exculpating himself? All I ever heard was a load subjective crap that boiled down to a vague charge of acting in a manner contrary to the Interests of The Corporation. It was so outrageous that even a lot of individuals no great fans of Bob and some of his tactics - Yours Truly and other Kite Strings members included - found themselves realigning.

2. As far as you know?

3. Pity we don't have a recording or transcript of the fake hearing, isn't it? The way we have over here to document the reasons for his banning from Kite Strings? I listened in on the whole thing and found it to be total crap - big surprise. If you're a legitimate organization with a legitimate reason for taking action against a member you want every scrap of the proceedings in black and white and available to everyone and his dog. Not:

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?
Jim Rooney - 2011/08/25 04:55:25 UTC

I mean seriously... ridgerodent's going to inform me as to what Kroop has to say on this? Seriously? Steve's a good friend of mine. I've worked at Quest with him. We've had this discussion ... IN PERSON. And many other ones that get misunderstood by the general public. It's laughable.

Don't even get me started on Tad. That obnoxious blow hard has gotten himself banned from every flying site that he used to visit... he doesn't fly anymore... because he has no where to fly. His theories were annoying at best and downright dangerous most of the time. Good riddance.
I am by no means defending USHPA here.
Good. I can't see how they've ever been the tiniest bit defensible. On anything for decades. Try checking out what happened when (1981/04) Donnell Hewett tried to publish a series of articles on a different approach to towing in which the lower connection was moved from the bottom of the control frame to the pilot. Then after he achieved critical mass on his own effort note how he got everything else involved in hang glider towing absolutely right.

http://www.birrendesign.com/rhgpa_criteria.html
RHGPA: Hewett skying criteria - Tungsten Rings
These are Donnell Hewett's original 12 elements of a good tow system. They are as viable today as they were in the early 80's when he wrote them.
No further discussion needed. Totally fucking amazing.
I am saying where Bob went wrong and why he was ineffective in preventing any accidents and why he may have actually hurt Shannon's case.
On the video I saw a solo student, rated to be able to "take off, fly straight and land" at a site so dangerous that to fly a hang glider one needs an Advanced rating requiring 25 logged thermal soaring hours, bouncing off a midair and seriously slamming in and heard an ACA PG instructor lie to her husband about the seriousness of the crash and where he was at the time.

And ACA has had the video taken down and gotten Bob to take down the link to my stills extraction from and transcript of the video.

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2429
Torrey Hawks Second Sunday - April 10th, 2016
Bob Kuczewski - 2016/04/11 16:24:32 UTC

Looks like they've got stuff they want out of the public eye - even after the settlement.

http://www.kitestrings.org/topic83.html
Brad Geary video
Yes, she was paid some undisclosed amount of money and I will bet anyone dollars to donuts that Lloyds of London said, "Pay her the nuisance value to make it go away."
I think I might also have wanted a couple million - as a bare minimum - had those assholes done to me what they did to her. I've had incompetent instruction and winch operation which has gotten me crashed and injured - fortunately not to anything like the extent she was.
The case was settled without a trial. It was settled based upon nuisance value. The settlement documents are non-public. That's the way it works.
Yeah, we certainly have gotten used to things being non-public in these sports, haven't we?
Bob, on the other hand was impeached as a witness.
When? Where? How? Why?
His credibility was a liability.
To whom? My credibility was a huge liability to u$hPa and they went totally berserk eight and a half years ago when I started going into whistleblower mode.
Bob Kuczewski - 2017/08/06 04:36:50 UTC
Luis Felipe Amunategui wrote:We need to consider getting an injunction against this guy communicating with the FAA on this subject.
Lisa Tate wrote:I forwarded the letter to Tim Herr yesterday asking about this.
Rich Hass wrote:Perhaps a strongly worded letter from Tim will do the trick. We can't force Tad to work within the USHPA framework but we can make it unpleasant and expensive for him if he chooses to makes derogatory and false statements about USHPA to the FAA he can't back up.

If I understand the previous comments, his sending USHPA a draft letter is an indication of willingness to engage in some dialogue before going to the FAA.

Good luck with this guy!
The pilot who I asked about towing was John Heiney and he definately knows towing.
And yet not one of these motherfuckers - or anybody else - has ever quoted so much as a misleading or out-of-context punctuation mark from any of the documentation I provided (much of it just transcribed from their own magazine crash reports). And it's pretty fucking obvious from Felipe's statement that I was totally dead-on about everything. Or can anybody come up with some LEGITIMATE reason one of those pieces o' shit would need to consider getting an injunction against this guy communicating with the FAA on this subject?

Also, if there was ever the slightest evidence that of me making derogatory AND false statements about u$hPa to the FAA he can't back up (versus all the derogatory and false statements about u$hPa to the FAA he CAN back up) how come there was never a suggestion from anybody that I be expelled from u$hPa?
That's all I have to say on the matter.
OK, but I haven't heard anything solid concerning false, misleading, out-of-context testimony from Bob. And, if valid, that shouldn't be too much of a trick 'cause I've documented tons of examples of misleading and out-of-context stuff from Bob concerning the Brad Geary / Zack and Max Marien / Alec tandem flights launched right after the midair incident in Bob's testimony to the San Diego City Council.
It's a shame that you and me and the rest of the gang here can't transform the sport into something far safer than it is. It would be great. It's a pipe dream.
I have zero delusions. We were optimistic at the founding of Kite Strings but as I began to understand the dynamics of what's going on and always has been and how the FAA, law enforcement, mainstream press, flying rank and file were all complicit...
At least your effort got me and several other pilots to start doing proper hook-in checks. Our efforts have had an influence on others.
Drop in the freakin' bucket. But it's some degree of change - read improvement.
But there comes a point where over-selling safety causes a backlash and the people we see as unsafe tell us all to go fuck ourselves and just engage with even greater carelessness.
1. That's not what happens. When we start getting through, u$hPa operatives ban us, threaten allies, lock threads, delete posts, play child molester and civility cards.

2. Fine.

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08-19
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Darwin's really good at making points concerning aeronautical competence. (All (ex) professional pilots by the way.)
This is the dilemma we face and yes, it's frustrating and infuriating.
I don't see any dilemma. I was biting my tongue all the fuckin' time when I was in the sport and flying. Now I just say what needs to be said and wait a couple weeks for somebody to again prove my point.

And I'll tell ya one thing... Because of the dynamics of the Baby Boom and the advent of paragliding the sport of hang gliding was gonna have become somewhat fragile at this point in history no matter what. But it's no way in hell sustainable under the control of a non pilot sleazebag corporate lawyer and a lot of big ass covering commercial tandem thrill ride operations. Stop by Ridgely Airpark on the Eastern Shore sometime for a good view into the future.
---
Letter from u$hPa to Bob notifying him of the expulsion decision and mandatory kangaroo court hearing date and time:
http://www.kitestrings.org/post7570.html#p7570

Bob's been on the phone to me today about this discussion and I'll be reconnecting his wire to allow him to respond/participate directly.
bobk
Posts: 155
Joined: 2011/02/18 01:32:20 UTC

Re: The Bob Show

Post by bobk »

Tad Eareckson wrote:Bob's been on the phone to me today about this discussion and I'll be reconnecting his wire to allow him to respond/participate directly.
Thanks Tad. Your assessment and posted response covers the territory pretty well. While we may disagree on a few points, they're not worthy of diverting attention from the thrust of your post which was right on target. Thanks again.

I just have one question for Jonathan at this time. Jonathan, what is your foundation for the following false and defamatory statement that you've posted to this forum?
NMERider wrote:Bob, on the other hand was impeached as a witness.
My testimony was never impeached. On what basis and on what evidence do you make that claim?
Join a National Hang Gliding Organization: US Hawks at ushawks.org
User avatar
Tad Eareckson
Posts: 9150
Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC

Re: The Bob Show

Post by Tad Eareckson »

Following is text from this document:
Expulsion_Response_2015_04_17.pdf
formatted for forum display.
INTRODUCTION

USHPA Board Members,

I have read the list of charges included in the Martin Palmaz letter dated March 20th, 2015. I have provided a written response to each of those charges by the numbers below with additional follow-on information. I have also received a second letter from Richard Hass on April 14th, 2015. The charges listed in the second letter were not sent in a timely manner so that I would have them within the required 10 days before the scheduled hearing on April 22nd. I asked Mr. Hass and Mr. Palmaz for a postponement of this hearing until the first week in May (ideally May 6th) so that I might address those additional charges, but Mr. Hass refused to grant me the requested postponement. Additionally, Mr. Hass responded to my request for postponement (see attached messages) by stating:

"While the memo provides additional detail to the claims already of record as you requested; it doesn’t add any new claims."

Similarly, on the Oz Report Forum, I asserted to Mr. Forbes a need for more time to address the recently added second letter, and he replied on April 16th, 2015 with this statement:

"There was nothing new in the most recent communication to him, just an emphasis on the questions that will be asked and a request that he come up with credible answers (if such there are) for those questions."

I believe that both of these statements are false, and I believe that there are explicitly new accusations and new questions in the second letter. However, since they were not presented in a timely manner, and since both Richard Hass and Mark Forbes assert that there is no new material in them, and since I was not granted the requested postponement to address them, I will confine my responses to the original Martin Palmaz letter of March 20th, 2015. The same is true of any additional materials that were offered to me via USHPA's web site on April 15th or any later date. I simply have not been given sufficient time to review all those additional materials and provide a response. If USHPA wishes to introduce items from the second letter or from USHPA's web site, then I am again requesting a postponement of my required response to May 6th, 2015.

In the event that USHPA decides to proceed with the expulsion hearing on April 22nd, 2015 without providing the requested postponement, I choose to make the proceedings open to all members and I will attend in the capacity of an observing member. I hereby ask that this document be distributed to all Directors in advance of the meeting, and that the video evidence mentioned in this document be viewed by all Directors at the meeting. Anyone listening from home may simultaneously view the videos from the web. And finally, I ask that one of the Directors most favorable to my efforts read this entire document as my statement to the Board.

Sincerely,
Bob Kuczewski
USHPA #81898
---
Video Evidence

The following videos (available at USHawks.org) are included in this response:

November 9th Incident:
http://ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1629&start=330#p11400
Tandem Violation:
http://ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1629&start=330#p11402
---
ANSWERS TO CHARGES BY THE NUMBERS

Let me start by the numbers. I will list the number of each charge from the Martin Palmaz letter of March 20th, 2015. I will immediately follow each number with "True" or "False" or "Not a violation". The meanings of these are as follows:

- True - The charge is factual in supporting my expulsion from USHPA.
- False - The charge is false and does not support my expulsion from USHPA.
- Not a violation - The charge itself is not a violation of any known rule, SOP, or Bylaw.

I will then follow each item with a brief description stating the facts as I know them.

1. Not a violation - Creating national hang gliding associations is not a violation of any USHPA SOP that I have ever read or has ever been presented to me (see Anti-Trust laws of United States).
2. False - I have not endangered the safety of anyone at Torrey Pines.
2a. False - I have not disrupted the training of students at Torrey Pines.
2b. False - I have not disrupted training of students at Torrey Pines.
2c. Not a violation - There is no rule prohibiting pilots from being on the field at Torrey Pines.
2d. Not a violation - There is no rule prohibiting pilots from being on the field at Torrey Pines.
3. False - I have not endangered the Torrey Pines Gliderport.
4. False - I have not made misstatements or misrepresentations to the City Council.
5. False - I have not misrepresented my relationship with USHPA to the City Council.
6. False - I absolutely believe those pictures of Gabe Jebb prompted the SOP change.
7. False - I have not published false or misleading statements about USHPA.
8. False - I have not misrepresented my qualifications to serve as an expert witness.
8a. False - I have not misrepresented my paragliding experience.
8b. False - I have not misrepresented my hang gliding experience.
8c. False - I have not misrepresented my duties as a USHPA Regional Director.
9. False - I have not made misrepresentations as an expert witness.
9a. False - I have personally witnessed at least 2 such collisions at Torrey Pines.
9b. False - My statements were made with respect to the top landing area since that was the area where the accident took place. The restriction is based on physical size of the LZ, obstructions on the the LZ, gliders on the ground in the LZ, students being trained on the LZ, and traffic on the LZ.
9c. False - The Torrey Pines landing zone is technically challenging for a variety of reasons including traffic in the air, kiting on the ground, instruction on the ground, spectators and bystanders in the LZ, multiple approach patterns, multiple aircraft types (HG, PG, RC, and sometimes sailplanes), complex wind patterns, potential rotor, and many other reasons.
9d. False - Minimum flight hours are a component of USHPA ratings which are used to rate sites.
9e. False - Minimum site ratings is a common practice. Sometimes that rating is "No rating".
9f. False - USHPA SOPs for P1 (12-02.13): "A Beginner pilot has the knowledge and basic skills necessary to fly and practice under direct instructor supervision and within significant operating limitations." The phrase "direct instructor supervision" clearly implies a method of communication by which the instructor may provide supervision. For sites like Dockweiler, this might be direct verbal communication. For sites like Torrey, Sylmar, Crestline, this is typically via direct communication via radio.
9g. False - I have watched the video and there were numerous gliders in the air and on the ground that day. It was a particularly good day as evidenced by the antics of tandem pilots Brad Geary and Max Marien. Furthermore, the fact that the two students collided while under instructor supervision is prima facie evidence that it was crowded enough for a collision.
9h. False - Allowing students to fly on a crowded day with ratings 2 or 3 levels below the site rating without direct supervision is an extreme departure from standard practice.
9i. False - The Torrey Pines Gliderport is rated as H4/P3 for a variety of reasons. Students without the required rating should only fly in uncrowded conditions and under direct radio supervision.
9j. False - All instruction of students must provide a reasonable "buffer" between each student and all other aircraft. The distance of the "buffer" must be based on the glider's speed, and the maximum expected time that it will take the student to control their glider or respond to commands. Any distance less than that is an accident waiting to happen.
9k. False - Every site must have rules (either explicit or implicit) to maintain safe separation between aircraft on approach and landing.
9l. False - I did not imply that multiple gliders could not land safely at Torrey Pines given pilots with the proper level of expertise.
9m. False - It does require extreme vigilance and concentration to safely monitor and guide a student who lacks the skills and ratings required to fly in the ambient conditions. When those ambient conditions include crowding, the difficulty for the instructor does increase exponentially. Indeed, when crowding is severe, there is no amount of instructor vigilance or concentration which can keep the student safe.
9n. False - Any distraction of the instructor (including from illness) represents a significant increase in risk to any student requiring guidance in the air.
9o. False - It is improper to allow pilots to exercise the privileges of any rating without having completed all the requirements and documents needed to obtain the rating.
---
GENERAL DISCUSSION BY CATEGORY

In addition to answering each charge "by the numbers" (above) I'd like to add some additional comments to each group of similar charges.

US Hawks

I have examined the USHPA documents, and I have not found any USHPA rule against creating competing organizations. Furthermore, since USHPA is effectively a monopoly, any threat to expel me for this particular charge is likely a violation of Anti-Trust laws. I have learned that someone has contacted the United States Department of Justice on this matter, and I have no further comment at this time.

Torrey Pines

The charges related to my "disruption" of instruction and being in an "active airfield restricted area" are all false. Those were the claims that Robin Marien used to try to convince the Judge (who had no experience in hang gliding or paragliding) that Torrey Pines was effectively equivalent to LAX airport. The "prosecution" (Robin Marien and his lawyer) presented their case for at least 6 days over the course of 4 months. During that entire time, they controlled the calling of witnesses and the direct questioning of those witnesses. They rested their case 1 hour before the end of the final day of the trial. So any statements made by the Judge up to that time were made without hearing a word of our formal defense case.

The reason that we were only given 1 hour to present our defense was evident in the Judge's final ruling. Robin Marien and his long list of witnesses had failed to show any evidence of violence or threats of violence or stalking or any other conduct required to sustain their request for a workplace violence restraining order against me. At that point, the Judge really didn't need to hear much of our defense, and in the interests of saving time and expense (for everyone) she severely limited our presentation of witnesses and facts. In particular, she allowed almost no testimony directed at establishing pilots' rights to use the site if they did not directly address the issue of workplace violence.

Even so, in the Judge's final ruling she wrote:

"Petitioner [Robin Marien and Air California Adventure] agrees that Respondent [Bob Kuczewski], being a pilot, has a right to be in the restricted area."

She went on to say:

"there is no indication that Respondent [Bob Kuczewski] has caused harm or intends to cause harm to any of Petitioner's employees. Under California law Civil Code Sec. 1708.8, it is not per se illegal for someone to film another in a public place regardless of whether there is a physical trespass or not ... (Civ. Code, section 1708.8). Use of the camera in a public forum is clearly acceptable but they cannot be used to harass or invade the privacy of another. Petitioner has not proven that Respondent has violated any privacy laws."

She further went on to say:

"none of the facts seem to support the conclusion that anything he [Bob Kuczewski] is doing is illegal"

She concluded with:

"The temporary restraining order is therefore denied and dismissed."

Now there can be many different interpretations of what the Judge said (and I'm sure there will be), but her final ruling was definitive and unambiguous. The order was denied and dismissed. In other words, Robin Marien, and Gabriel Jebb, and Danielle Kinch, and their whole crew had falsely accused me of doing something that I had not done. That speaks volumes. That ruling clearly casts doubt on any of the past, present, and future claims made by Robin Marien and his "crew" against me. So any accusations by Robin Marien or any of his employees or associates must be viewed in light of them making false accusations which were not upheld in a court of law.

The take away message from this - for USHPA - is that when evaluating conflicting claims between Robin Marien and myself, I have earned and deserve the benefit of the doubt. I add this "benefit of doubt" to the already implied presumption of innocence and ask that all of the charges based on allegations by Robin Marien or his "crew" be dismissed by USHPA. These include charges 2, 2a, 2b, 2c, 2d, 2e, and 3.

As additional supporting material, I direct the USHPA Board to the photographic and video evidence in the topic titled "Jailed for taking pictures at Torrey" available at:

http://ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1629

In addition to the photos and video of the event, that topic also contains a full transcript of the event.

City Council

I stand behind all of my statements to the San Diego City Council. In several years of speeches, it wouldn't surprise me if I had made a mistake somewhere, and I'd be happy to review any specific statement that USHPA has a problem with. But so far, USHPA hasn't shown one statement that I've made to the City Council that is false or a misrepresentation of anything. I may speculate or ask rhetorical questions when presenting to the City Council, but I do not make false statements or statements that are misrepresentations.

The Palmaz letter does call out my statements that the USHPA helmet SOP change was based on the November 9th incident with Gabe Jebb. I firmly believe my representation to the City Council was correct, and I have yet to see any evidence from USHPA (or anyone else) to the contrary. The old helmet SOP had been in place for years, and yet within weeks of my filming and publishing of Gabe Jebb's poor example, the USHPA EC "coincidentally" felt the need to change that SOP ... between USHPA Board Meetings? Furthermore, Rich Hass specifically wrote an unsolicited letter to me telling me about that particular SOP change. Why would he do that if the SOP change was completely independent of that incident?

USHPA

There's only one charge in this category: "Repeated publication of false and misleading statements concerning USHPA, its officers and its directors."

Again, there have been no specifics provided. Instead, I expect Tim Herr will dredge up some obscure error I've made somewhere in the last 10 years or cite my improper spelling of "U$HPA" as a "false or misleading statement". If there's something that USHPA feels I've published that's in error, then the proper procedure is to cite that specific publication and communicate a request for correction. To date, USHPA has failed to make any such a request.

I stand fully behind my primary criticisms of USHPA:

1. Failure to act responsibly regarding the problems at Torrey Pines.
2. Failure to support a balanced Soaring Council as per USHPA's Spring 2010 Board Resolution.
3. Arbitrarily deciding who can attend or cannot attend Executive Committee meetings.
4. Failure to provide open and accountable voting records by the Board. Note that the Board's recent practice of reporting "unanimous" votes does not satisfy this requirement because it does not give members an unambiguous voting record for each Director. Members cannot tell if a particular Director simply failed to vote or may not have even been in the room. Several years ago I had a fairly detailed discussion about this problem with Director Bolosky (see attached email from Bill Bolosky). Mr. Bolosky was attempting to remedy this problem by keeping an accurate accounting of which Directors entered or exited the room so absent Directors could be tracked. However, even if such a system were implemented, it would not account for Directors who either failed to vote or later claimed to fail to vote. The bottom line is that even to this day (as evidenced by the Board's most recent minutes) there is no unambiguous way for members to tell which Directors voted for which measures.

Expert Witness in Hamby Case

This category of charges includes claims that I've misrepresented my hang gliding experience or my paragliding experience or my duties as a Regional Director. As mentioned in the introduction, I have have requested the specific statements that USHPA is claiming that I've made. USHPA has not responded in a timely manner with any specific statements despite my repeated requests. Unless shown otherwise, I believe the description of my experience and/or duties in those capacities was properly represented. In particular, my duties as a Regional Director were taken Directly from the USHPA SOPs that defined them.

Testimony in Hamby Case

This category of charges is USHPA's (and Tim Herr's) attempt to either punish me or get me to recant my testimony in a case where a young woman was injured while under radio instruction with a Torrey Pines instructor. As listed by the numbers (above), I stand behind all of the statements made in that testimony.

As background for this discussion, I direct the USHPA Board to the video evidence in the topic titled "Jailed for taking pictures at Torrey" available at:

http://ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1629

That video shows not only the incident itself but a subsequent flight by two Torrey Pines Tandem instructors (Brad Geary and Max Marien) each with a child passenger engaging in stunts that clearly threaten USHPA's FAA tandem exemption and possibly the FAA's view of our ability to be "self-regulated" sports under USHPA's domination. This is particularly troubling given the recent events at Jean Lake.

With regard to the ratings allegations, Torrey Pines is rated and enforced as an H4/P3 site. The primary usefulness of USHPA ratings lies in their ability to match pilot skill levels with site requirements. So if a site is rated as "P3" that clearly means that someone has determined that P0, P1, and P2 pilots do NOT possess the skills needed to safely fly that site under commonly occurring or commonly expected conditions. Furthermore, the USHPA SOPs state very clearly the "Recommended Operating Limitations" for each rating:

P0: "It is highly recommended that all flights be made under the direct supervision of a USHPA Certified Basic or Advanced Instructor."

P1: "It is highly recommended that all flights be made under the direct supervision of a USHPA Certified Basic or Advanced Paragliding Instructor. " "Should fly appropriate sites for this skill level."

Both of those use the phrase "under the direct supervision" of a USHPA instructor. The word "direct" is very clear. If you look up the word "direct" at wiktionary.org, you'll find that its first definition is:

1. Straight, constant, without interruption. ( https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/direct )

In other words, both the P0 and P1 rating come with a USHPA Recommended Limitation that ALL flights be conducted under the straight, constant, and uninterrupted supervision of a USHPA instructor.

Furthermore, it is either stated (P1) or implied as obvious (P0) that pilots must fly appropriate sites for their rated skill level. Again, what other relationship could we assign between pilot ratings and site ratings?

The Torrey Pines Gliderport has been rated as a "P3" site for at least 10 years. Now we all know that instructors can use their judgment to allow pilots with less of a rating to fly at a site with a higher rating. But such an exception places the burden on the instructor to ensure that all such rating exceptions are conducted safely. It cannot be the student's responsibility because the student has already been determined not to possess the skill and judgment to fly the site. When an instructor allows a student to fly at a site above the student's rating, the instructor is using the instructor's own judgment (on conditions, weather, crowding, etc) to "make up the difference" between the student's own skills and the skills needed to fly the site safely. Again, there can be no other relationship that makes sense.

That explanation formed the core of my testimony in the Hamby case, and I stand firmly behind it. The bulk of the March 20th Palmaz letter (items 9a through 9o) attempts to discredit that core by attacking a number of my related statements. I have addressed them all in my "by the numbers" response above and I stand behind those statements as well.

USHPA's Purpose

As mentioned earlier, I have requested the citation for any specific USHPA bylaws or SOPs that I've been accused of violating. So far the only response has been Bylaws Section 4 paragraph iv:

Expulsion of the member based on the good faith determination by the Board of Directors or a committee designated to make such determination that the member has failed in a material and serious degree to observe the rules of conduct governing this corporation as promulgated by the Board from time to time or has engaged in conduct materially and seriously prejudicial to the purposes and interests of the corporation.

Since no rules of conduct have been cited, this leaves the only remaining clause to be:

"has engaged in conduct materially and seriously prejudicial to the purposes and interests of the corporation."

This brings up the question of what are the purposes and interests of the Corporation. Article I Section 2 of the Bylaws state this:

"The primary purposes of the Association are to engage in the development, study and use of hang gliders and the sport of hang gliding; to make available and disseminate knowledge about hang gliders and hang gliding; to promote the organization of meets and competition for the flying of hang gliders; to select pilots for national and international competition; to promote the training and rating of students interested in learning the art of hang gliding; and to promote safety and safe flying practices. As used in these Bylaws, the term "hang gliding" encompasses all fuel-less flight systems and aircraft capable of being launched by human power alone."

My actions over the past 7 years have been in perfect alignment with those stated purposes. Let me list a few that come to mind:

1. Creation of the Torrey Hawks Hang Gliding Club in 2007.
2. Creation of the US Hawks Hang Gliding Association in 2010.
3. Assistance in creating and promoting new USHPA Chapters in the United States.
4. Design and use of "Little Hawk" as an outreach tool for the general public.
5. Efforts to provide oversight at Torrey Pines to promote the fair use of hang gliders.
6. Efforts to provide oversight at Torrey Pines to promote safety and safe flying practices.
7. Efforts to obtain site insurance at Torrey Pines to further ensure our continued use of that site.
8. Efforts to promote hang gliding by honoring our history via the ongoing Otto meets.

I'm sure that's not the full list, and you can find more at the US Hawks web site http://ushawks.org.

Furthermore, and more to the point, it remains to be seen whether the actions that USHPA is claiming are "prejudicial to the purposes and interests of the corporation" might indeed turn out to be exactly what the corporation (and the sport in general) needs most right now. It could be easily argued that my efforts to obtain oversight at Torrey Pines would have prevented the Hamby accident by putting the concessionaire under closer scrutiny. It could easily be argued that my efforts at oversight might have prevented the obscene abuse of the FAA's tandem exemption demonstrated by the Brad Geary and Max Marien flights shown on the video. In other words, there is no clear or "materially" evident conclusion whether my actions are prejudicial to the corporation or in its best interests. Indeed, USHPA member #5, Joe Faust has publicly called for Presidential awards for my efforts. While I wouldn't go so far as to justify that at this time, Joe makes the very clear point that the view of my actions is highly subjective.

Conclusion

In conclusion, I assert that I have not violated any of the SOPs, Bylaws, or any other rules of USHPA that would justify my expulsion. I hereby request that this hearing make that determination. The Presidential Citation can come later.
---
From: Richard Hass <richhass@comcast.net>
To: Bob Kuczewski <bobkuczewski@gmail.com>
Cc: Martin Palmaz <martin@ushpa.aero>
Subject: Re: Request for Materials and Time for Review
Date: 04/16/2015 09:58:43 AM

In response to your request for additional time, you are reminded; you were given 33 days notice from the date of Martin’s notice. USHPA bylaws require 10 days notice (15 days notice of the expulsion date minus 5 days between the hearing and the expulsion date). You have already been given 3X the required advance notice.

Although USHPA believes Martin’s letter satisfies the notice requirements and provides sufficient detail in order for you to respond to the claims, USHPA provided you with considerably more detail in the memo you received earlier this week. While the memo provides additional detail to the claims already of record as you requested; it doesn’t add any new claims.

USHPA believes you have been given more than adequate time to prepare your response. Accordingly, USHPA will adhere to the April 22nd scheduled hearing date and deadlines previously established.
---
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=41619&start=361

Mgforbes - 2015/04/16 21:29:56 UTC
Nothing to fear (except bagpipes)

Bob's already had three times the required notice. There was nothing new in the most recent communication to him, just an emphasis on the questions that will be asked and a request that he come up with credible answers (if such there are) for those questions. He has had PLENTY of time. I said up at the top of this thread, weeks ago, that he needed to focus on making his case to the board of directors, instead of trying to stir up "popular support" for his cause. Apparently he has not taken that advice.

We don't want to drag this on forever. My personal opinion is that Bob's stalling, and he can continue stalling right up to the hearing next Wednesday. After that the board will consider what he has to say for himself and make a final decision on whether to expel him. If he has cogent arguments for why his behavior has not been materially and seriously prejudicial to USHPA and its interests, then he can make those arguments to the board. I'm sure that among the many pages he has written here he can come up with some excerpts to support his position.

If Bob can come up with some convincing arguments in his favor, I will take careful note of them as I make my own decision on his expulsion. I'm sure that other BOD members will do likewise. It is the board's job to determine what is, and what is not, action prejudicial to USHPA and its interests. That's a subjective determination, not a bright-line reading of some clause in an SOP. That is what the board is charged to do, under our Bylaws and under California corporate law. It is one of the responsibilities and duties that we accept when we are elected by the members to serve as directors. The members have delegated to us the task of managing the association, which on occasion includes disciplinary actions against individual members.

The Bylaws have been that way since USHPA was founded. This is not some sort of unusual language written into them to "get" BobK. Private membership associations, of which USHPA is one, have the right and the duty to determine whether someone is fit for membership, and the duty to deny membership or expel a member if they decide a person does not meet their standards. Those can include subjective standards such as taking actions which cause harm to the Association, as determined by the board.

To take an absurd example, if the board decided that I was harming USHPA by playing bagpipes outside the office in Colorado, they could vote to expel me from USHPA. "We can't get the membership cards processed with all that caterwauling going on!" That's materially and seriously prejudicial (in an absurd sense) because it causes expense and annoyance to our staff (earplugs, etc) and interferes with our ability to provide member services. The office staff would have already asked me politely to stop, and I would have refused. (And played even louder.) The board would have asked me to go somewhere else, and I would have loudly proclaimed that it's a public sidewalk and they can't keep me from practicing there. The police would have been called, and asked me nicely to move along, and maybe even cited me with a noise complaint after a repeat performance. And the next day, I'd be right back there again making a racket outside Beth's window, "asserting my rights as a citizen". Eventually a restraining order would be filed, USHPA's board would vote to expel me, and I'd either get arrested and jailed for violating the order or I'd finally go elsewhere. And then Beth could get some peace and quiet, at last.

I've always wanted to learn to play the bagpipes ...

MGF
---
From: Bill Bolosky <bolosky@microsoft.com>
To: Bob Kuczewski <bobkuczewski@gmail.com>
Subject: RE: USHPA Voting
Date: Fri, 24 May 2013 17:05:33 +0000

We had a long discussion about recording votes at the beginning of the meeting. Roughly two things happened. First, Dave Broyles brought a motion that would have prevented me from recording the names of any voting directors unless I was required to do so by the rules. If it had passed, I wouldn’t have been able to record the names of people voting no on a voice motion, for example. I brought a motion to have Dave’s motion voted on by roll call, which passed. So the roll call vote you see at the beginning of the minutes shows the five directors who wanted to make it harder to record people’s names.

We then went on to discussing my idea of keeping track of the people who came and went. Somehow this managed to get to a final vote before I was able to make a motion to use a roll call (which I suspect was mostly my fault rather than a scheme by Rich or anything). There were a total of 20 directors at the meeting (more showed up later). Dan Tomlinson had left the room, so there were 19 voting. It tied at 9-9, which left the president to break the tie. He voted no, and that was that. I’m really sorry that I didn’t get the roll call motion in for this vote, it was a big mistake. So, roughly, you know five of the 10 people who voted no: the five who voted yes on Broyles’ motion, minus Tomlinson plus Hass. I know that Mark and I voted yes. What I don’t know (and again apologize for) is who the other five were.
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bobk
Posts: 155
Joined: 2011/02/18 01:32:20 UTC

Re: The Bob Show

Post by bobk »

Thanks for posting that Tad.

That was my formal response to all of USHPA's charges. I sent it to USHPA on April 17th, 2015.

The very next day, I followed up with a message to USHPA's president (Rich Hass) and the official administrative office email for USHPA. I also blind copied it to a large number of observers who can verify it. Here's that message:
From: Bob Kuczewski
To: Richard Hass
Cc: USHPA Administrative Office <info@ushpa.aero>
Subject: Response to "Notice of Expulsion Hearing"
Date: Sat, 18 Apr 2015 17:35:08 -0700

Rich Hass (cc/bcc others),

I am in receipt of an email message (presumably from you) sent to all USHPA members which presents a one-sided and slanderous description of my actions. You cite the Judge's comments completely out of context. That context is that she found me innocent of all the charges that were filed by the Torrey Pines Concessionaire against me. How is it that in your long and detailed message, you somehow omitted that one single most important outcome of the trial?

Furthermore, your message does not provide me with any ability to respond to the roughly 10,000 members of USHPA to which it was sent.

Such an action is an unacceptable use of your broadcast power to attack an individual USHPA member. I am asking that each of the following be done immediately:

(1) Send my PDF Statement to the same list of members.
(2) Provide me with all email addresses to which this was sent.
(3) Send a retraction notice to all members canceling the expulsion.

Finally, your abuse of the USHPA email list to present a one-sided portrayal of events is disgusting in itself. But your prohibition against allowing members to even post and discuss your actions is beyond what I expected even of you. Please look at the actions you've been forced to take due to the poor decisions you've made over the last 7 years. For the good of hang gliding and paragliding, I urge you to execute a 180 degree turn and retreat from your current path.

Thoroughly Disgusted,

Bob Kuczewski
858-204-7499
You'll note that I requested that USHPA send my response to the same list of members who received USHPA's broadcast of my expulsion charges. USHPA failed to do so.

The result is that there are approximately 10,000 USHPA members (including Jonathan) who only saw USHPA's side of my expulsion. That was by design so they (like Jonathan) would all go forth in ignorance to make the kind of misstatements that Jonathan has made above:
NMERider wrote:Bob, on the other hand was impeached as a witness.
Jonathan, I'll ask you again: On what basis and on what evidence do you make that claim?
Join a National Hang Gliding Organization: US Hawks at ushawks.org
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NMERider
Posts: 100
Joined: 2014/07/02 19:46:36 UTC

Re: The Bob Show

Post by NMERider »

bobk wrote:....You'll note that I requested that USHPA send my response to the same list of members who received USHPA's broadcast of my expulsion charges. USHPA failed to do so.

The result is that there are approximately 10,000 USHPA members (including Jonathan) who only saw USHPA's side of my expulsion. That was by design so they (like Jonathan) would all go forth in ignorance to make the kind of misstatements that Jonathan has made above:
NMERider wrote:Bob, on the other hand was impeached as a witness.
Jonathan, I'll ask you again: On what basis and on what evidence do you make that claim?
Publish the entire USHPA package Bob. Put it up on a Google Drive folder where any interested party can see it.
Publish all of the evidence to the contrary you provided to USHPA on a similar Google Drive folder where any interested party can see it as well.
While we are at it, please publish all of your correspondence with Shannon and/or her attorney(s).
Additionally please publish your expert witness contract along with copies of all invoices and payments received by you with respect to this matter.

I'll be more than happy to highlight the evidence that leads me to conclude that your credibility as a witness was impeached and that you were a liability to her case.
Please be reassured that I am not taking side here with USHPA. If I find that I was mistaken about the record and the meaning of the evidence I'll be more than happy to proffer my apology along with a retraction of my conclusions.
It doesn't get any better than that now does it?
Cheers, NMERider
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