instructors and other qualified pilot fiends

[Tad Eareckson]

Got him...

http://www.ushgrs.org/H4.html
H4 ratings United States Hang Gliding Rating System USHGRS

Thomas Howard - H4 AWCL CL FSL RLF TUR XC
"Red", aka Tom Howard - HGpilot

http://www.energykitesystems.net/HGpilots/ThomasHoward.html
Thomas Howard

Thomas Howard - "Red"
===
His core page:
https://user.xmission.com/~red/
===
Historic note from rec.aviation.soaring

Hi, I would like to hear a bit more about the Carbon Dragon. My name is Tom Howard, but folks call me Red. I worked at Upslope in Denver with Bob and Gary Folkers for a few years around 1978. I never met you, but I've heard a lot about you. Then I moved to Utah, and flew Klaus' Fledgling, I &II. Flew with Larry Hall when he flew the QuadraPlane. Still flying a 177 Magic IV, got a couple thousand hours airtime, none of it powered. Dick Cheney is a friend.

I like what I hear about the Carbon Dragon for glide ratio and sink rate. I have no doubt it would be great around these mountains.

So, if you would, please... I have a few dozen questions about the Carbon Dragon.
- How is it to fly?
- Have you car-towed it?
- How long did it take to build it?
- Any special problems?
- Are the plans good and clear?
- How's the upkeep?
- Is it rugged or fragile?
- Anything you've changed or added?
- What are the G limits?
- What's it weigh, empty?
- Comments or criticisms?
and thanks . . . Red

Or rather, he kinda gave himself to us.

Thanks to Steve for getting me woken up.

[Steve Davy]

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=36142
Revoking My Membership Here

SkyPoke - 2018/08/29 03:47:40 UTC

Hey SG/Jack,

How does someone terminate their membership to this forum? I've given you enough to "ban me" but I'd rather leave of my own free will. There's just too much "HATE" here. Maybe for me "too much" is not as much as most members here. I wouldn't think that the smell of crap while sitting in a cesspool could so easily be ignored, but as far as I'm concerned I've had as much as I can take.

I'm done doing the below -

[<BS>]

Veteran hang glider Dan Buchanan Glider Accident at 2018 MTN Home Airshow
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHRWFpcYTck

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=57134

[Steve Davy]

http://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.aviation/brief.aspx?ev_id=20180602X62747
NTSB Identification: WPR18LA163

[<BS>]

This looks like a solo version of Kelly's "perfect storm".

[Tad Eareckson]

"Perfect storm" hits the nail on the head really well.

Zack C - 2011/03/04 05:29:28 UTC

As for platform launching, I was nervous about it when I started doing it. It looked iffy, like things could get bad fast. I've since logged around a hundred platform launches and have seen hundreds more. Never once was there any issue. I now feel platform launching is the safest way to get a hang glider into the air (in the widest range of conditions). You get away from the ground very quickly and don't launch until you have plenty of airspeed and excellent control.

Safest way to get a hang glider into the air in the widest range of conditions - and there were no conditions. Double fatal with a zillion hour Five "pilot" and the youngest kid killed in the history of the sport as the "student". Virtually unlimited altitude in which to work things out and not the slightest thought given to the parachute.

I think that in the entire history of modern hang gliding there's nothing that comes anywhere close to this one with an intact glider at that altitude. Really had to bend over backwards to get so many issues simultaneously lined up so wrong.

And at the other end of the altitude spectrum in the perfect storm category... Zack Marzec a bit over two years prior. Hang Four tandem aerotow instructor flying pro toad (with more positive control authority over his glider) and a zillion hour tug driver / Pilot In Command. Tumbles twice from no more than 150 feet the instant the safest safe towing system focal point ever devised by The Industry increased the safety of the towing operation and put the glider into inconvenience mode. And to this day nobody who's anybody has the slightest clue what went wrong...

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?

Cragin Shelton - 2011/09/03 23:57:33 UTC

Nice Reference Citation

Do you REALLY think that there has been no progress in knowledge about the practical applied physics and engineering of hang gliding in 37 years? OR that an early, 3+ decade old, information book written by a non-pilot is a solid reference when you have multiple high experience current instructors involved in the discussion?

...and what could've been done the slightest bit better to achieve a less catastrophic outcome.

This Mountain Home incident... Really hard to figure out what went wrong and why but I don't think there would be the slightest practical benefit to the sport in doing so. This wasn't a dust devil issue and there's nothing we're gonna start doing better or differently on our approaches in response to any lessons learned.

[Tad Eareckson]

And...

09-20
http://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5315/29962431842_1b260f7a81_o.png


...here we are again, Jim. Just celebrated the second anniversary of the permanent end of your participation in any flavor of sport aviation - and almost certainly any other flavor of aviation as well.

Last Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney post anywhere - 2017/01/31 03:15:17 UTC. On The Davis Show. And four months from now we'll be celebrating the second anniversary of that event.

You sleazy motherfuckers ended my active flying career - which had begun (not counting skydiving parachutes) 1980/04/02 - such that my last flight was 2008/10/12. That was just a wee bit shy of a decade ago. But I've still got strong web presence - which the mainstream bends over backwards to pretend doesn't exist. And if you wanna find any recent references to Jim Rooney then Tad's Hole In The Ground is where you're gonna hafta go. 'Cause the mainstream is also bending over backwards to pretend that you don't and never did exist and it never promoted you to the position it did - as the cornerstone of its currently, rapidly, catastrophically collapsing Ponzi scheme.

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=49837
Jim Rooney tandem paraglider incident in New Zealand

Jim Rooney - 2016/10/01 05:55:48 UTC

Up from surgery... Plates on L2 while it heals, will come out after. Feeling good.
I won't comment on my crash just yet.

Implying that at some point you WILL "COMMENT ON" *YOUR* crash in reasonably short order. So what's the holdup? What possible reason or reasons could you have for not commenting? You didn't have any problems commenting on your 2006/02/21 hang gliding tandem thrill ride incident at the same fucking launch, well prior to any publication of any fake CAA investigation report, and patiently explaining to all us clueless muppets how, in failing to hook yourself in (then dangling from the control bar and diving the glider and your "student" into the power lines), you did absolutely nothing wrong. Because there are no truly effective procedures for preventing unhooked launches.

(Pity you only reached this realization as a consequence of that incident and weren't able to advise your passenger/student of the risk prior to the launch. But now things are much better 'cause they currently have it on all the waiver forms. Right?)

By the way...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=31781
Another hang check lesson

Alan Deikman - 2014/09/23 19:47:06 UTC

For my part I will just refer you to the classic Tad Eareckson essay which I call "the gun is always loaded" which is a bit overworked but probably all you will ever need to read regarding FTHI. A lot of people will find it gores their particular sacred Ox, but I have never seen anyone point out a flaw in his logic.

Nobody, including/especially YOU, has ever challenged that endorsement - posted in Jack's Living Room in clear violation of Emperor Jack's rules on one of the two official unofficial u$hPa forums - ANYWHERE.

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=27909
Dragonfly Accident at Lookout

Jim Rooney - 2012/06/09 03:05:22 UTC

BTW, you have no need or use of reminding me of the other tug pilot that we lost.
She was a friend of mine and an exceptionally close friend of my mates.
You will likewise not be able to inform me of anything regarding her accident.
Allow me to inform you.
She was a rookie and it was a rookie mistake made under duress and extremely low.

Yeah? So what was yours? Maybe give us a wee bit more detail than you did in this blatant fabrication regarding the nature of Keavy's Dragonfly totaling fatal crash.

By the way... There's no such thing as a "rookie" tug driver or "rookie" tug driver mistake. All tug drivers have lotsa powered ultralight time under their belts before they ever get a glider hooked up behind them and after one good weekend they've logged more tows than any one of the gliders (s)he's pulling will rack up in three seasons. Not to mention the fact that she'd dumped the tandem almost as soon as it had gotten airborne and her crash had as much to do with towing as Mark Knight' subsequent fatal or:

http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3695
good day until the wreck

Lauren Tjaden - 2008/12/31 04:29:12 UTC

came in with no wind after an hour and had right wing drop. instead of wrestling gilder straight i tried to flare while desperately trying to straighten.

bad bad whack. horrible pain, i could not move. screaming with pain, literally. took a very long time to get me out and to the hospital. got very good drugs.

Maybe after the CAA investigation.

Or maybe not.

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=16439
Some day we will learn

Steve Morris - 2010/03/31 23:58:54 UTC

In 2009 there were several serious hang gliding accidents involving pilots on the HG forum (or who had close friends on the forum that reported that these accidents had occurred). In each case there was an immediate outcry from forum members not to discuss these accidents, usually referring to the feelings of the pilots' families as a reason to not do so. In each case it was claimed that the facts would eventually come out and a detailed report would be presented and waiting for this to happen would result in a better informed pilot population and reduce the amount of possibly harmful speculation.

In each of these cases I have never seen a final detailed accident report presented in this forum. So far as I can tell, the accident reporting system that has been assumed to exist here doesn't exist at all, the only reports I've seen are those published in the USHPA magazine. They are so stripped down, devoid of contextual information and important facts that in many cases I have not been able to match the magazine accident report with those mentioned in this forum.

The end result has been that effective accident reporting is no longer taking place in the USHPA magazine or in this forum. Am I the only one who feels this way?

CAA works EXACTLY the same way that u$hPa does for EXACTLY the same reasons.

The Press - 2006/03/15

The Civil Aviation Authority (CAA) is urgently pushing for new hang-gliding industry standards after learning a hang-gliding pilot who suffered serious injuries in a crash three weeks ago had not clipped himself on to the glider.

Extreme Air tandem gliding pilot James (Jim) Rooney safely clipped his passenger into the glider before departing from the Coronet Peak launch site, near Queenstown, CAA sports and recreation manager Rex Kenny said yesterday.

Where'd that one go? How come we never heard about the expert testimony you provided to illustrate to them why new hang-gliding INDUSTRY STANDARDS...

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?

Jim Rooney - 2011/08/26 06:04:23 UTC

Take this weaklink nonsense.
What do I "advocate"?
I don't advocate shit... I *USE* 130 test lb, greenspun cortland braided fishing line.
It is industry standard.
It is what *WE* use.

...wouldn't work?

Besides... Who does the CAA have to provide a better understanding of the factors and issues involved with this one than...

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=22660
What can be learned from this "scooter" towing accident?

Mitch Shipley - 2011/01/31 15:22:59 UTC

Enjoy your posts, as always, and find your comments solid, based on hundreds of hours / tows of experience and backed up by a keen intellect/knowledge of the issues when it comes to most things in general and hang gliding AT/Towing in particular. Wanted to go on record in case anyone reading wanted to know one persons comments they should give weight to.

...Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney?

Never mind. In reviewing the traffic in preparation for this annual celebration...

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/84789157/paragliders-injured-after-a-crash-in-queenstown
Paragliders injured in Queenstown crash | Stuff.co.nz

Dasha Kuprienko - 2016/09/30 08:33

In a statement, Skytrek Tandem Hang Gliding and Paragliding said the injured pair landed on a slope on the side of Coronet Peak, about halfway between the take-off point at Coronet Peak car park and the intended landing point at Flight Park, off Malaghans Rd.

Weather conditions were stable at the time, and it was not yet known why the incident happened, the company said.

Oh. The weather conditions were STABLE at the time. Why should that matter? Aren't paragliders sport soaring aircraft designed and certified to be flown in thermal/UNstable conditions? I know I never bothered to throw my glider on the car and head to Ridgely unless the forecast indicated major instability. Does Davis Dead-On Straub, who's been at an around all this plenty long enough to understand what's what and who's who, plan national and international glider comps at times of year and locations based on likelihoods that the conditions will likely be stable? Don't u$hPa SOPs MANDATE flying, soaring in unstable conditions to get a half decent rating? The kind you need to run tandem thrill rides?

Stable conditions...

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30971
Zach Marzec

Paul Tjaden - 2013/02/07 23:47:58 UTC

The weather conditions seemed quite benign. It was a typical winter day in central Florida with sunny skies, moderate temperatures and a light south west wind. It
Just posting here too let people know that I'm doing well.

Just like they were all day until a few seconds after Zack Marzec got airborne behind Mark Frutiger and Zack's pro toad bridle and Industry Standard weak link shortly thereafter became problematic.

Paragliders are fuckin'...

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=54907
Lost Site?

Mark G. Forbes - 2018/02/01 05:26:59 UTC

I fly my PG in morning and evening air, relatively light winds or at coastal sites with consistent, smooth air. If it's getting thermic, or particularly, thermic with wind, then I don't want to be up there. Mid-day, I pretty much don't fly in summer; I do this for fun, and I prefer the milder morning and evening conditions. Others have a higher tolerance for turbulence and risk, and skills beyond mine.

...LETHAL in thermal conditions and everybody and his dog know this - 'specially the tandem thrill ride industry. Skytrek doesn't breathe a single word about thermals on its crappy tandem thrill ride industry website. But if you have a higher tolerance for turbulence and risk and skills beyond those of Mark G. Forbes then go for it. Mother Nature will respect your personal circumstances and make adjustments as necessary.

Note the cumulus clouds in 09-20 above.

Just posting here too let people know that I'm doing well.

Nobody gives a flying fuck, Jim. 'Specially after Highland Aerosports needed one tug driver to keep it from imploding and you had better things to do with your flying career and/or Highland Aerosports considered you a non-option.

And... Just noticed. Whereas Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney WAS identified by the mainstream press on his Coronet Peak 2006/02/21 he WASN'T for his Coronet Peak 2016/09/29. That's not an oversight. That's a cover-up. Meshes in nicely with the fake CAA investigations that never produce any results after never having been conducted.

So none of the tandem thrill ride operations would want anything to do with you even if you weren't too crippled to carry on with tandem foot launch stuff.

http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3600
Weak link question

Jim Rooney - 2008/11/24 05:18:15 UTC

Well, I'm assuming there was some guff about the tug pilot's right of refusal?
Gee, didn't think we'd have to delve into "pilot in command"... I figured that one's pretty well understood in a flying community.

It's quite simple.
The tug is a certified aircraft... the glider is an unpowered ultralight vehicle. The tug pilot is the pilot in command. You are a passenger. You have the same rights and responsibilities as a skydiver.
It's a bitter pill I'm sure, but there you have it.

Pretty well understood in the both of your mainstream news appearances, wasn't it motherfucker?

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=31052
Poll on weaklinks

Jim Rooney - 2013/03/04 19:31:36 UTC

The accepted standards and practices changed.
I still won't tow people with doubled up weaklinks. You don't get to "make shit up". I don't "make shit up" for that matter either.

We all play by the same rules, or we don't play.
Morningside decided that they were happy with 200lb weaklink. They changed their tug's link and they don't just pass the stuff out either. If you'd like to know more about it... go ask them.
The law of the land at comps was 130lb greenspot or you don't tow. Seriously. It was announced before the comp that this would be the policy. Some guys went and made their case to the safety committee and were shut down. So yeah, sorry... suck it up.

That's not an image the tandem thrill ride industry wants to project.

And what do you think would happen in the wake of a THIRD newsworthy tandem thrill ride incident? 'Specially one in which one of your cute chick passengers got seriously injured or killed? The press and one of the ambulance chasing attorneys would have fuckin' FIELD DAYS.

The only thing you ever flew solo was a 914 Dragonfly tug. And you never did anything cool...

162-080114
http://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1840/44117113812_9e03c8fd24_o.png

248-121914
http://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1812/44165014841_2026d914d7_o.png

280-142607
http://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1832/44165003831_3562f1fa36_o.png

327-155904
http://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1875/44117061412_f8b1b162df_o.png


...with it. Just talked about all the lives you'd saved by giving people the rope in incidents nobody else ever experienced, witnessed, knew anything about.

You never flew a hang glider solo 'cause you couldn't afford to risk getting your ass thoroughly kicked by a convicted paedophile. You never even landed a hang glider solo in real world conditions 'cause...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=25536
Whoops! Snapped another tip wand :-O

NMERider - 2012/03/14 15:17:14 UTC

Landing clinics don't help in real world XC flying. I have had the wind do 180 degree 15 mph switches during my final legs. What landing clinic have you ever attended that's going to help? I saved that one by running like a motherfukker. And BTW - It was on large rocks on an ungroomed surface.

Jim Rooney threw a big tantrum and stopped posting here.

His one-technique-fits-all attitude espoused on the Oz Report Forum has become tiresome to read. It does not work in the fucked-up world of XC landings and weary pilots.

...none of your landing bullshit actually works in real world conditions.

See ya again at the end of NEXT September when there will still be no CAA investigation report and no comment from you on your crash.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25656
The young girl who died hang gliding solo

Jim Rooney - 2012/03/06 18:34:14 UTC

ND's onto it.

No one ever wants to wait for the accident investigation... they want to know "NOW DAMNIT!" and there's always a lot of self-serving arguments surrounding it.

And it's always the same.
The same damn arguments get drug up every time. And they're all just as pointless every time.

We have a system in place.
It works.
Let it work.

Our procedures are well established at this point in time and there are no gaping hidden holes that need to be addressed immediately.

RR asked what the status was.
ND's provided the answer (thank you).

Please take a deep breath. And wait.
Accident investigations involving fatalities take a long time. And by long, I mean they can take years.
(yes, years, I'm not kidding)

The sky is not falling.

ND's onto it.

But of course. Davis Show member in good standing. How could we expect anything less?

No one ever wants to wait for the accident investigation...

I do. I like to wait years. (Yes, YEARS. I'm not kidding.) We've waited over two years for yours now and it didn't even involve fatalities. I like to wait years because that tells me that the few people who are actually working on things are doing really thorough jobs.

...they want to know "NOW DAMNIT!" and there's always a lot of self-serving arguments surrounding it.

Yeah, fuck all those people who want to know "NOW DAMNIT!"

This:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flyhg/message/17223
Pilot's Hotline winter flying

Mark Frutiger - 2013/02/03 13:41

Yesterday was a light and variable day with expected good lift. Zach was the second tow of the afternoon. We launched to the south into a nice straight in wind. A few seconds into the tow I hit strong lift.

Zach hit it and went high and to the right. The weak link broke at around 150 feet or so and Zach stalled and dropped a wing or did a wingover, I couldn't tell. The glider tumbled too low for a deployment.

is the kinda utter crap you get when information is released in something well under 24 hours. There's absolutely no mention of the strong low level turbulence, probably a dust devil that could not be seen due to the lack of dust in Florida, that Paul Tjaden reported on after only an additional four days from his superior perspective of not having witnessed anything.

And it's always the same.

Go figure.

The same damn arguments get drug up every time. And they're all just as pointless every time.

Such a pity. And hard to understand given all the effort you've devoted to get all us stupid muppets up to acceptable speed.

We have a system in place.

Who's "we"? And how much say did "we" have in putting it in place?

It works.

Just like the Standard Aerotow Weak Link does. Nobody knows or can explain exactly what it works to do but we're all totally good with it 'cause of its extremely long track record.

Let it work.

Fer sure. We're just passengers after all anyway. So we're really good at letting things work under the control of our superiors.

Our procedures are well established at this point in time and there are no gaping hidden holes that need to be addressed immediately.

Lois Preston's parents might have felt differently but... Fuck 'em. What do they know?

RR asked what the status was.
ND's provided the answer (thank you).

Well then. We're all good now.

Please take a deep breath. And wait.

Please eat a big serving of shit. And die.

Accident investigations involving fatalities take a long time. And by long, I mean they can take years.
(yes, years, I'm not kidding)

Yeah? Does anybody remember?:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copa_Airlines_Flight_201
Copa Airlines Flight 201

A year after the crash (1992/06/06), the story of the crash of Flight 201 and its investigation was featured in a WGBH, BBC, and NDR documentary. It was screened in the United States in the PBS NOVA series as Mysterious Crash of Flight 201 on 30 November 1993...

I watched it at the time, almost certainly on its premier airing. Big fuckin' 737, blew up in the air and the wreckage slammed into the jungle. Nighttime, no witnesses 47 fatalities, a zillion pieces scattered over a twelve mile diameter debris field. They figured out EXACTLY what happened and why and we muppets were watching the documentary on Nova less than eighteen months later and understanding everything thoroughly.

Versus a fucking hang glider crash? Virtually all of them are witnessed and everyone and his dog typically know everything relevant several seconds or more prior to impact. The system we have in place exists solely for the purposes of destroying evidence, obscuring data, buying off and/or intimidating witnesses, covering criminally negligent u$hPa operative asses, waiting out public attention spans.

Dan Buchanan 2018/06/02 is something of an exception to the rule in that we'll probably never know WHY what happened happened but we had a hundred percent of the relevant data before the smoke cleared and we knew the flight plan had been way the fuck down the toilet well before impact. And we know that whatever was going on there's no lesson to be learned or re-emphasized to improve things for anybody down the road.

The sky is not falling.

Nah, but the ground sure came up fast and put your sleazy ass permanently outta commission, didn't it?

Paragliders... I see a headline about a serious crash I don't even bother to read further. Collapse. Ninety-nine times out of a hundred you're gonna be right. And finding out the one percent of the incidents in which I'm wrong isn't worth my investment in the time.

Fly a glider in thermal conditions or conditions with thermal potential... You're not a pilot, you're a dice roller. Just like the pro toad assholes...

00-14603
http://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1933/44102650815_176479a7f1_o.png

http://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1904/30077684987_2c21fc5fbf_o.png
14-14603

...who fly with bent pin easily reachable releases and Rooney Links to increase the safety of the towing operation.

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30971
Zach Marzec

William Olive - 2013/02/27 20:55:06 UTC

Like the rest of us, you have no idea what really happened on that tow.
We probably never will know.

Jim Rooney - 2013/02/28 01:17:55 UTC

Well said Billo
I'm a bit sick of all the armchair experts telling me how my friend died.

Ah but hg'ers get so uppity when you tell them not to speculate.

And here I was thinking that accident investigations involving fatalities take a long time. And by long, you mean they can take years. (Yes, years. You're not kidding.) Yet when it's a friend of yours we have the bullshit from Quest in five days and twenty days after that you two fuckin' asshole tug drivers have determined that no one will ever know one scrap of accurate relevant information to use to narrow things down a bit and make a single recommendation.

Sounds like they're using the wrong people to investigate most of these accidents involving fatalities. Flight Park Mafia operatives are so obviously so much more efficient and effective at determining that we'll never have any idea of what really happened.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/84789157/paragliders-injured-after-a-crash-in-queenstown
Paragliders injured in Queenstown crash | Stuff.co.nz

Dasha Kuprienko - 2016/09/30 08:33

In a statement, Skytrek Tandem Hang Gliding and Paragliding said the injured pair landed on a slope on the side of Coronet Peak, about halfway between the take-off point at Coronet Peak car park and the intended landing point at Flight Park, off Malaghans Rd.

Weather conditions were stable at the time, and it was not yet known why the incident happened, the company said.

That's as much as we're EVER gonna get on that one. And nobody's EVER contradicted anything in that statement and nobody EVER will. So let's go with it.

Halfway between launch and landing. So it obviously wasn't launch or landing related. Skytrek says the conditions were stable.

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30971
Zach Marzec

Jim Rooney - 2013/03/07 18:24:58 UTC

You're the one advocating change here, not me.
I'm fine.

You're the one speculating on Zack's death... not me.
Hell, you've even already come to your conclusions... you've made up your mind and you "know" what happened and what to do about.
It's disgusting and you need to stop.
You weren't there. You don't know.
All you have is the tug pilot report, who himself says he doesn't know... and HE WAS THERE... and he doesn't know.

Ever heard of "Confirmation Bias"?
Because you're a textbook example.
You were out looking for data to support your preconceived conclusion, rather than looking at the data and seeing what it tells you... which is why this is the first time we've heard from you and your gang.

Go back to Tad's hole in the ground.
While you're there, ask him why he was banned from every east coast flying site.

No contradictions from the Pilot In Command. So the conditions were stable.

So if they:

- actually WERE then Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney lacks the competence to safely complete a tandem thrill ride in glassy brain-dead easy air.

- WEREN'T and Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney was performing at the max of human capability then paragliders can't be safely flown if there's any possibility of a thermal breaking loose anywhere.

So pick one...

He's not competent enough to fly a tandem thrill ride in brain dead easy conditions on a paraglider - EITHER - and lacks the ounce of character required to fess up, publicly apologize for the major damage he caused, maybe help somebody else rewire to prevent a rerun.

A stray thermal turned his canopy to garbage, it was a matter of luck that he didn't tie Kelly Harrison for number of participants killed on a single routine tandem thrill ride. And he still lacks the ounce of character required to fess up, publicly apologize for the major damage he caused, maybe help somebody else rewire to prevent a rerun. Just that in this scenario the issue is his long Industry Standard defense of paragliders as perfectly safe thermal soaring aircraft - in the face of the reality of untold thousands of PG collapse fatalities which have long proven otherwise.

Weather conditions were stable at the time, and it was not yet known why the incident happened, the company said.

Smoking gun. That the weather conditions were stable at the time is something one tends NOT to hear as a lead-off statement regarding a hang glider crash and we generally assume that they're NOT. And this is a tip-off that Skytrek PG tandem thrill rides aren't run in thermal soaring conditions. And if they were then they weren't then they aren't now. ("Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury... On 2016/09/28 Skytrek was quite aware of the extreme danger associated with operating paraglider flights in unstable conditions. Yet they knowingly and deliberately CONTINUED...")

P.S. At the time I'd taken a cursory look at:

http://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5340/30028963335_2e0bbe381a_o.png


and had come away with the impression that Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney had gotten a reserve out but had been too low for it to have done much - if any - good. And had the upright guy as a choppered-in first responder. But something had always bothered me.

Nah, those are obviously two PG canopies. I'm guessing that the one in the foreground was the tandem thrill ride and the one beyond was a solo recreation guy who'd shortly prior landed to render assistance. I'm pretty sure both Jim and his latest and final victim are still down and that the latter is the nearer.



Looks like a color/pattern match.

P.P.S. Notice how there's ZERO mainstreamer interest in / concern about the facts that in over two years we haven't gotten a single syllable's worth of information from any source - CAA, Skytrek, pilot or bystander eyewitnesses, perpetrator, victim, mainstream press - beyond the panicked crap Skytrek blurted out fifteen minutes after impact?

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25656
The young girl who died hang gliding solo

Jim Rooney - 2012/03/06 18:34:14 UTC

We have a system in place.
It works.
Let it work.

We did, it didn't. Never has, never will. Get fucked.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_hang_gliding
History of hang gliding

1978. The Atlas (La Mouette) entered the market. The pilot flew in a prone position. The Atlas had all of the safety elements that can still be found today.

1980-97. Fifth Generation - Preformed battens. Floating cross bar. Cross bar enclosed in double surface. Hang glider performance then increased rapidly. The first truly successful "double surface" hang gliders were the Manta Fledge IIB (1979 US Nationals), Tom Peghiny's Kestrel and later the UP "Comet" designed by Roy Haggard (1980). Virtually all hang gliders over the next decade were refinements of the Comet. The first fifth-generation hang gliders to dispense with a raised keel pocket were the Wills Wing "HP" in the US and Enterprise Wings "Foil" in Australia (1984). Bob Trampenau of Seedwings introduced the VG (variable geometry), which was copied on most other hang gliders.

The pilot flew in a prone position.

Of what conceivable value is THAT?

16-031309
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http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7671
Gallery Of Pain

Christian Williams - 2012/01/18 19:58:00 UTC

Here's the way Greblo looks at it (or how I remember his lectures):

We take off and land upright. Therefore, all the bad stuff happens when we are upright. And close to the ground.

Therefore, learn to fly upright in the worst conceivable (and sudden hairy) conditions. (One up/ one down is "upright").

The alternative, if "more secure prone", is to go prone instantly upon take-off, and stay prone until the last possible landing moment.

In both cases, this requires a change of hand and body position in the worst conceivable conditions near the ground.

Therefore, in order never to change hand position near the ground, it is necessary to learn to face all the worst moments (thermals, gusts, sinkholes, midairs, gear failure, downwind landings and takeoffs, a lifted wing into boulders and an entire wire ground crew snagged on your jock strap) upright.

A little reflection suggests that taking off upright and flying upright until well away from the danger zone is not very different from ground handling, where you are flying standing on dirt. A good test of upright flying skills is whether you can ground handle a glider in 25 mph of laminar flow. Do you require a wire crew? Hmmm.

Greblo will not sign off a Hang 3 (US intermediate rating) who cannot ground handle with confidence at the limit of his takeoff judgment.

He's not dogmatic about this for veteran fliers, recognizing that gliders and skills and terrain are different. He just provides his analysis. You often see him flying around in violent thermals upright, just (I think) as a kind of advertisement and thought-provoker.

Totally unfathomable how clueless people were forty years ago.

Total recipe for disaster. Think about it for a minute or two. The overwhelming percentage of serious free flight hang glider crashes occur when the pilot is flying upright with his hands on the control tubes at shoulder or ear height just after slope launches and in the courses of landings. If people flew upright all the time, 'specially in violent thermal conditions, they'd all have totally masterful upright flying skills and free flight launching and landing crashes would be things rapidly fading into the past.

Nice going, La Mouette. Hope you're sleeping well nowadays.

The first fifth-generation hang gliders to dispense with a raised keel pocket were the Wills Wing "HP" in the US and Enterprise Wings "Foil" in Australia (1984).

Meaning the "floating crossbar" / extended keel pocket innovations were total bullshit.

07-0911
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Which tells us that NOBODY in or related to the fuckin' sport - not Francis Rogallo, John Dickenson, Bill Moyes, Bill Bennett, Gérard Thereunto, Bob Trampenau, Steve Pearson, Dennis Pagen, Donnell Hewett - understood shit about how hang glider roll control actually works. And there was nobody on the fuckin' planet from the outside with the requisite cranial capacity looking at what was being done during this phase of aeronautical history. And that paved the way for:



and the Hewett Infallible Weak Link.

And if I recall correctly Wills Wing / Steve Pearson debunked the floating crossbar bullshit by putting a camera on the keel and watching how things dynamically interacted with each other. Shouldn't have taken that. This issue could/should've been thought through. That's all Einstein did for his Theory of Relativity ferchrisake.

Bob Trampenau of Seedwings introduced the VG (variable geometry), which was copied on most other hang gliders.

Which was the RIGHT way to enhance hang glider roll control authority. The "floating crossbar" was something-for-nothing pie in the sky which did NOTHING but crap up the gliders. VG was a reality based tradeoff - roll control authority for performance. And ya got a BEAUTIFUL clean flying wing out of the deal - with cleanly engineered implementation that's remained virtually unchanged since its inception.

We're always hearing Bob oozing praise over the pioneers of this sport. I have more respect for Brian Pattenden than all the rest of them put together. No physical implementation, test piloting, experience, trail and error... Just THINKING and THEORY.

So with a totally fucking clueless historical foundation the parasites inevitably move in, get their opinions firmly embedded, take over, set the sport on its ever accelerating path to destruction. There's no established and respected authority to say, "No Ryan. You're totally full o' shit, incompetent and/or lying to protect your reputation, disseminating lethal misinformation to your students and the public. We're revoking your Instructor appointment and suspending your ratings." But of course in a sport with a foundation in competence he'd have never made it to within a tiny fraction of that position in the first place.